My opinion on HTML5

jacob · 2012-07-22 22:29:20

A while ago, HTML5 was released. It was the first major update to HTML in years. It was met with much popularity. After looking at a lot of Scratcher-made websites, I see a lot of those use HTML5 as well.
HTML5 is most notable for the shorter DOCTYPE and audio/video embed support.

However, it does have its flaws.
First off: the short DOCTYPE...
The DOCTYPE is just <!DOCTYPE html>. How am I (or your browser) supposed to know the difference between that and HTML6, whenever that comes out? I think that using the DOCTYPE that way was not planning for the future, and just thinking in the present.

Second off: sloppiness
In HTML5, you don't have to close self-close tags. A line break is acceptable as . There is no need to close tags like that. That is really sloppy, because looking at code, it appears that the tag never ends.
You can also not put values for attributes, like this: <input type="text" readonly>. If you put an attribute, there should always be a value.
I believe you can also omit some end tags, like this:

<div id="something">
<p>Paragraph 1
<p>Paragraph 2
<p>Paragraph 3
</div>

and it would be completely valid. That is really sloppy! All tags must end!

So, with all of that in mind, if you look at the source code for this site and the forums, you will notice that it uses XHTML 1.0. That is because LS97 and I value well-formed syntax. We believe that all tags must close, and all attributes must have values. We believe that the document must have well-formed syntax instead of the sloppy syntax that HTML5 allows.

So, long story short...I do not like HTML5. XHTML is better, because it has syntax that is better formed, is more human, and is easier for a computer to read.

ftf841 · 2012-07-22 22:39:36

mm...

RedRocker227 · 2012-07-23 10:06:11

I agree.

SJRCS_011 · 2012-07-23 16:35:02

Um, I disagree, for a couple of reasons:
1. It is up to the coder to decide what his/her preferred syntax is. The reason many developers like HTML5 are it's many new and helpful features, and it's somewhat forgiving syntax. Furthermore, if you want to be a neat freak, then code in the XHTML syntax with HTML5. It's possible, because HTML5 is forgiving, but not as sloppy as HTML4.

2. You could easily change the doctype to accommodate HTML6 when it comes out. It could be something like

<!DOCTYPE HTML6>

3. What's wrong with

<input type = "checkbox" id = "me" value = "me" checked />

? I mean, this is more human-readable than

<input type = "checkbox" id = "me" value = "me" checked = "checked" />

At his/her work, whoever invented the XHTML version must have worked in the department of redundancy department at his/her work. If you want to be helpful, then do checked = 'true', but otherwise, it doesn't make sense.

4. If you are educated about HTML, you would know that <img>, , <hr>, and <meta>, among others, don't have a closing tag, which sort of defeats your point. Only someone who doesn't know HTML or is just plain naive would think that the tag never ends

5. Also, you once said that you'd like to modify the JS Player once it comes out. There's one problem with that if you want to stay XHTML: the XHTML DOCTYPE doesn't support canvas; only the HTML5 one does.

Also, that code you put up there? It isn't valid in HTML5, so I'd suggest you not misinform people.

Anyway, that's my opinion

And why am I "The Ultimate Answer?"

Last edited by SJRCS_011 (2012-07-23 16:36:23)

jacob · 2012-07-23 16:41:44

You are the Ultimate Answer because of your post count.

I will respond to the rest of your arguments later, as I am tired from exercising.

LS97 · 2012-07-23 16:47:34

I'm sorry to contradict you SJRCS, but img, br, and hr tags among others do close.
If you are educated about HTML, you would know that some tags may self close using a slash. Only someone that doesn't know HTML or is lain naive would ignore the use of self closing tags, i.e. ending a starting tag with a /> to avoid the redundancy (funny how you mentioned it too) of having to say .

SJRCS_011 · 2012-07-23 16:53:59

LS97 wrote:

I'm sorry to contradict you SJRCS, but img, br, and hr tags among others do close.
If you are educated about HTML, you would know that some tags may self close using a slash. Only someone that doesn't know HTML or is lain naive would ignore the use of self closing tags, i.e. ending a starting tag with a /> to avoid the redundancy (funny how you mentioned it too) of having to say .

Did I ever say they don't close?
Furthermore, I myself use XHTML syntax with HTML5, I just don't think it's so important that everyone in the whole wide world has to be perfect.
After all, they aren't.
Furthermore, HTML5 does not require that you use to avoid redundancy. They also don't require that you use the /> in case you don't want to, or you were taught not to.
In my case, i do use />, but i just think it's stupid to insist on everyone being so neat if the website works fine without it.
Just my opinion.

Last edited by SJRCS_011 (2012-07-23 16:54:34)

jacob · 2012-07-23 17:01:19

SJRCS_011 wrote:

LS97 wrote:
I'm sorry to contradict you SJRCS, but img, br, and hr tags among others do close.
If you are educated about HTML, you would know that some tags may self close using a slash. Only someone that doesn't know HTML or is lain naive would ignore the use of self closing tags, i.e. ending a starting tag with a /> to avoid the redundancy (funny how you mentioned it too) of having to say .
Did I ever say they don't close?
Furthermore, I myself use XHTML syntax with HTML5, I just don't think it's so important that everyone in the whole wide world has to be perfect.
After all, they aren't.
Furthermore, HTML5 does not require that you use to avoid redundancy. They also don't require that you use the /> in case you don't want to, or you were taught not to.
In my case, i do use />, but i just think it's stupid to insist on everyone being so neat if the website works fine without it.
Just my opinion.

If you look at the code, doesn't close. One of the FluxBB developers says this: "Since code is often read and re-written, it is very important to write clean code". So, as you will probably revise code, you should write it cleanly.
That is why I insist on being neat.

SJRCS_011 · 2012-07-23 17:13:21

jacob wrote:

SJRCS_011 wrote:
LS97 wrote:
I'm sorry to contradict you SJRCS, but img, br, and hr tags among others do close.
If you are educated about HTML, you would know that some tags may self close using a slash. Only someone that doesn't know HTML or is lain naive would ignore the use of self closing tags, i.e. ending a starting tag with a /> to avoid the redundancy (funny how you mentioned it too) of having to say .
Did I ever say they don't close?
Furthermore, I myself use XHTML syntax with HTML5, I just don't think it's so important that everyone in the whole wide world has to be perfect.
After all, they aren't.
Furthermore, HTML5 does not require that you use to avoid redundancy. They also don't require that you use the /> in case you don't want to, or you were taught not to.
In my case, i do use />, but i just think it's stupid to insist on everyone being so neat if the website works fine without it.
Just my opinion.
If you look at the code, doesn't close. One of the FluxBB developers says this: "Since code is often read and re-written, it is very important to write clean code". So, as you will probably revise code, you should write it cleanly.
That is why I insist on being neat.

Yes, but there's neat, and then there is being a neat freak.
I understand that neat code is important, i just don't see why you have to require that everyone is neat through XHTML. HTML5 lets people be, well, people.
And I also don't just use HTML5 for the little bit of forgiving; I mainly use it for it's features, mainly canvas.
Which reminds me, how will you include the javascript player in an XHTML webpage?

Last edited by SJRCS_011 (2012-07-23 21:36:47)

jacob · 2012-07-23 17:15:27

SJRCS_011 wrote:

jacob wrote:
SJRCS_011 wrote:
LS97 wrote:
I'm sorry to contradict you SJRCS, but img, br, and hr tags among others do close.
If you are educated about HTML, you would know that some tags may self close using a slash. Only someone that doesn't know HTML or is lain naive would ignore the use of self closing tags, i.e. ending a starting tag with a /> to avoid the redundancy (funny how you mentioned it too) of having to say .
Did I ever say they don't close?
Furthermore, I myself use XHTML syntax with HTML5, I just don't think it's so important that everyone in the whole wide world has to be perfect.
After all, they aren't.
Furthermore, HTML5 does not require that you use to avoid redundancy. They also don't require that you use the /> in case you don't want to, or you were taught not to.
In my case, i do use />, but i just think it's stupid to insist on everyone being so neat if the website works fine without it.
Just my opinion.
If you look at the code, doesn't close. One of the FluxBB developers says this: "Since code is often read and re-written, it is very important to write clean code". So, as you will probably revise code, you should write it cleanly.
That is why I insist on being neat.
Yes, but there's neat, and then there is being a neat freak.
[Insult removed by moderator] I understand that neat code is important, i just don't see why you have to require that everyone is neat through XHTML. HTML5 lets people be, well, people.
And I also don't just use HTML5 for the little bit of forgiving; I mainly use it for it's features, mainly canvas.
Which reminds me, how will you include the javascript player in an XHTML webpage?

Once XHTML5 is completely ready, we will likely start using that here.

Wettining · 2014-07-17 21:45:08

HTML5 is my favorite programming language because it is the easiest to combine with other languages (such as my other favorite CSS3).
But usually I use the classic HTML code.

Blueinkproductions · 2014-07-28 21:22:20

Wettining wrote:

HTML5 is my favorite programming language because it is the easiest to combine with other languages (such as my other favorite CSS3).
But usually I use the classic HTML code.

HTML5 is a markup language, not a programming language.

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#1 2012-07-22 22:29:20

My opinion on HTML5

#2 2012-07-22 22:39:36

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#3 2012-07-23 10:06:11

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#4 2012-07-23 16:35:02

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#5 2012-07-23 16:41:44

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#6 2012-07-23 16:47:34

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#7 2012-07-23 16:53:59

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#8 2012-07-23 17:01:19

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#9 2012-07-23 17:13:21

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#10 2012-07-23 17:15:27

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#11 2014-07-17 21:45:08

Re: My opinion on HTML5

#12 2014-07-28 21:22:20

Re: My opinion on HTML5

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